By:Mahesh Raja (UK)
“The guru MUST be situated on the topmost platform of devotional service. There are three classes of devotees, and the guru MUST be accepted from the topmost class.”
“When one has attained the topmost position of maha-bhagavat, he is to be accepted as a guru and worshipped exactly like Hari, the Personality of Godhead. ONLY SUCH A PERSON is eligible to occupy the post of a guru.”
- (C.c. Madhya 24.330, purport)
Nectar of Devotion - 8 Offenses to Be Avoided
The offenses against the chanting of the holy name are as follows: (3) TO DISOBEY THE ORDERS OF THE SPIRITUAL MASTER.
Gour-Gadadhara dasa prabhu would you care to explain HOW an OFFENSIVE chanter can give Diksha?
They are now trying to JUSTIFY in ISKCON, a Madhyama can give diksha because EVERYONE KNOWS they are NOT Maha-bhagavata.
Something below to refresh Gour-Gadadhara Prabhu’s memory of what Diksha means:
Reply to Nimai Pandit Prabhu
Nimai Pandit Das: My desire is to come to understand fully, if it is the Truth (I am keeping the possibility open that it may not be), and to explore the possibility that the process of Diksha is explained so comprehensively, THAT THERE CAN BE NO QUESTION TO ACCEPT THAT ONLY SRILA PRABHUPADA IS THAT DIKSHA GURU, OF ALL OF US. AND THAT AS A SIDE ISSUE JULY 9TH LETTER is of course, so natural. I think to try to prove/disprove the July 9th letter from the angle of past “ritvik” practices is superficial and a play in logic by both sides.
Mahesh: VERY EASY. Let’s consider the following facts:
1) WHY did Srila Prabhupada ARRANGE to have his OWN murti in ALL the temples in ISKCON for worshiping during Guru Puja UNLESS he was GIVER OF the DIVYA Jnana hrdaya prakasito HE GIVES DIVYA JNANA (DIKSA)
ONLY a MAHABHAGAVATA is accepted as Worshipable Diksha Guru as per Chaitanya Charitamrita Madhya 24.330. Srila Prabhupada is THE ACHARYA of ISKCON.
NOTE: It is ONLY ACHARYA that can give DIKSHA because even in Nectar of Devotion this is stated REGARDING ACCEPTING INITIATION from the spiritual master it refers to Srimad Bhagavatam 11.17.27 which is ACHARYA.
Nectar of Devotion 7 — Evidence Regarding Devotional Principles
REGARDING ACCEPTING INITIATION from the spiritual master, in the Eleventh Canto of Srimad-Bhagavatam, Seventeenth Chapter, verse 27, it is stated by Lord Krishna, “My dear Uddhava, the spiritual master must be accepted not only as My representative, but as My very self. He must never be considered on the same level with an ordinary human being. One should never be envious of the spiritual master, as one may be envious of an ordinary man. The spiritual master should always be seen as the representative of the Supreme Personality of Godhead, and by serving the spiritual master one is able to serve all the demigods.”
Srimad-Bhagavatam 6.7.15 Purport — Indra Offends His Spiritual Master, Brihaspati:
“By the mercy of the spiritual master one is benedicted by the mercy of Krishna. Without the grace of the spiritual master, one cannot make any advancement.” A disciple should never be a hypocrite or be unfaithful to his spiritual master. In Srimad-Bhagavatam (11.17.27), THE SPIRITUAL MASTER IS ALSO CALLED ACHARYA. Acaryam mam vijaniyan: the Supreme Personality of Godhead says that one should respect the spiritual master, accepting him as the Lord Himself. Navamanyeta karhicit: one should not disrespect the acharya at any time. Na martya-buddhyasuyeta: one should never think the acharya an ordinary person. Familiarity sometimes breeds contempt, but one should be very careful in one’s dealings with the acharya. Agadha-dhisanam dvijam: the acharya is a perfect brahmana and has unlimited intelligence in guiding the activities of his disciple.
2) Srila Prabhupada put it DELIBERATELY in all his books FOUNDER-ACHARYA. Srila Prabhupada did NOT say he was only ISKCON founder. There is HYPHEN in between the words Founder AND Acharya which indicates HE IS ALSO ITS CURRENT ACHARYA.
3) There is ALSO the FACT that ONLY INITIATED DISCIPLE will be Director.
This means HE wanted to REMAIN the INITIATOR for the EXISTENCE of the society: Other WILL Srila Prabhupada’s Will.
The executive directors who have herein been designated are appointed for life. In the event of death or failure to act for any reason of any of the said directors, a successor director or directors may be appointed by the remaining directors, provided the new director is MY INITIATED DISCIPLE following strictly all the rules and regulations of the International Society for Krishna Consciousness as detailed in my books, and provided that there are never less than three (3) or more than five (5) executive directors acting at one time.
4) Letter: Madhudvisa, August 4, 1975
The GBC should all be the instructor gurus. I AM IN THE INITIATOR GURU, and you should be the instructor guru by teaching what I am teaching and doing what I am doing. This is not a title, but you must actually come to this platform. This I want.
Conversations, March 12, 1968, San Francisco
Prabhupada: Yes, I AM the spiritual master of this institution, and ALL the members of the society, they’re supposed to be MY disciples. They follow the rules and regulations which I ask them to follow, and they are initiated by me spiritually. So therefore the spiritual master is called guru. That is Sanskrit language.
5) Disciple belongs to whoever gives DISCIPLINE TO him: In ISKCON we are ALL being DISCIPLINED by Srila Prabhupada (we receive instructions (DISCIPLINE) FROM Srila Prabhupada’s books. Even the most basic discipline, 16 rounds of Hare Krishna Mantra and four Regulative Principles are coming FROM Srila Prabhupada. Common sense — if you ARE being disciplined BY Srila Prabhupada then it follows you ARE Srila Prabhupada’s disciple. How can it be otherwise?
The MEANING of the word “disciple”
Srila Prabhupada’s Morning Walk, March 8, 1976 in Mayapur:
Prabhupada: “Discipline… Disciple means discipline. The word discipline comes from disciple, or disciple comes from discipline. So unless there is discipline, there is no question of disciple. This discipline must… That should be uniform. Otherwise, sisya… sisya, the word sisya, it comes from the root, verb, sas-dhatu. sas means ruling. From this word, sasana. Sasana means government. sashtra means weapon, and sastra, scripture, and sisya… These things have come from the one root sas-dhatu. So sas-dhatu means ruling under discipline. There is another English word, that “Obedience is the first law of discipline,” or something. They say, “Obedience is the first law of discipline”? So I am right? “Obedience is…”? That is the…
Tamala Krishna: Yes, that’s more or less what it is.
Prabhupada: No, what is the word, exact. There is an English word. “Obedience is the first law of discipline.” So unless there is obedience, there cannot be any discipline. And unless there is discipline, there is no question of disciple. DISCIPLE MEANS ONE WHO FOLLOWS DISCIPLINE.”
Discipline comes from Srila Prabhupada. We are actually being disciplined by Srila Prabhupada. It is Srila Prabhupada who has given us the regulative principles of no meat, fish or eggs; no intoxication (including tea and coffee), no illicit sex, and no gambling. It is Srila Prabhupada who has made it a regulative principle for us to chant sixteen rounds on the beads HARE KRISHNA HARE KRISHNA KRISHNA KRISHNA HARE HARE /HARE RAMA HARE RAMA RAMA RAMA HARE HARE.
Srila Prabhupada’s books contain all the instructions, the guidance required for us to get ourselves out of the clutches of the modes of material nature. In fact, Srila Prabhupada is personally present as his books.